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Bad Religion

Interview von: Adrian Schütte & Jan Oberländer mit Jay Bentley, am: 01.02.2002 ]

Wer hätte gedacht, dass das neue Bad Religion Album "The Process Of Belief" ein solcher Old-School-Kracher wird? Warum diese plötzliche Rückbesinnung auf alte Stärke? Um dieser Frage nachzugehen, trafen wir Gründungsmitglied und Basser Jay Bentley in der Lounge des piekfeinen Fünf-Sterne-Hotels "Hyatt" (das ist Punk!) zum dreiviertelstündigen Gespräch über das neue Album, Mr. Brett, Preispolitik, Amerika, Punk, Die Toten Hosen und vieles mehr..


Musicscan: (Adrian) So, let’s talk about the new album. We consider the new album to be very „back-to-the-roots“ with its short fast old-school songs, which wasn’t the case on the last two albums „No Substance“ and „The New America“. What was the reason to change the musical direction again?

Bad Religion: (Jay) Because I think the last two albums weren’t very good! (laughs) This album IS good!

Musicscan: (Adrian) We think so, too!

Bad Religion: (Jay) We had the ability to look back on the last two albums and say: „Those aren’t very good. They suck!“

Musicscan: (Adrian) Really?!

Bad Religion: (Jay) Well, there are some good songs on them, but as an album... I don’t know, really. (Jay’s mobile rings, short intermission) The new album was made the way we made suffer. So, a year ago, Bad Religion as a band was over. It was done. After the Blink 182-tour we had our own tour and I said to Greg: „Fuck this!“ and he said: „Yes!“. Then Bobby got hurt his arm, we walked away from Sony/Atlantic and so it was over. We were finished and it was kinda sad because we were just fizzling out, we were dragged.

Musicscan: (Adrian) So, did it play a big role that Mr. Brett decided to rejoin the band?

Bad Religion: (Jay) Yeah, it was a great kick in the ass! It wasn’t like that he came back in to the band and said: „Come on guys, we can save Bad Religion!“ We just started talking about it, then Brooks Wackermann (ex-Suicidal Tendencies, The Vandals) came into the band, Brett wrote some songs and we all got excited again!

Musicscan: (Adrian) Regarding the fast songs on the new album, were they mainly written by Mr. Brett (there are no song credits in the booklet)?

Bad Religion: (Jay) Yeah!...Well, no, I mean, Greg writes songs like „Kyoto Now“ or „Materialist“ which are more complicated.

Musicscan: (Adrian) That’s a good point, I recognized that the guitars and the bass play far more technical and complicated stuff than on the last albums. So, is there any connection between this and the new drummer? He’s very good...

Bad Religion: (Jay) ...oh, he’s phenomenal...

Musicscan: (Adrian) ...yes, so you were personally challenged by his skills?

Bad Religion: (Jay) I, as a bass player, I heard him playing and I just thought: „Fuck!“ (laughs) Brian and I were talking about how we were gonna play on this record. Sometimes, on the last couple of records, I got disillusioned, I didn’t give a shit, just play this song. Just do this take, it’s not that bad, so I’m done. But on this record I spent a long time playing and enjoying until I got a great idea. You just keep playing it until you did something that is better than the last one. That’s what I wanted.

Musicscan: (Adrian) There are even some great bass solos on the new record...

Bad Religion: (Jay) I could never play them again. I was just making them up (laughs).

Musicscan: (Adrian) ...so I think this is a big difference to the last records.

Bad Religion: (Jay) It IS a big difference!

Musicscan: (Adrian) It’s obvious you put much effort in the new songs.

Bad Religion: (Jay) That’s what Brian, Brooks and I talked about. Let’s really get a step up, and I had to with Brooks. Brooks is just amazing! And Brian is a six string god anyway (Jay imitates a guitar solo and laughs).

Musicscan: (Adrian) The music of Bad Religion is mainly written by Greg and Brett. How many influence on the development of the songs do the other instrumentalists have?

Bad Religion: (Jay) It depends on how much the song is done. Sometimes they come in just with a basic guitar part, which is nothing, so we make the song up together. „Epiphany“ is a perfect example for a such a song. Greg had this bass line which sounded like „Stickin‘ in my eye“ from NoFX. I told him that, but he said he really wanted to play that, because it’s an essential part of the song, he wrote the melody line around that. I said: „I’ll play that. But I have to call Fat Mike and apologize: I’m sorry dude, I stole your line!“

Musicscan: (Adrian) Yes, I wanted to ask about that. I thought maybe it should be a revenge for the „Surfer“ SevenInch by NoFX.

Bad Religion: (Jay) (Laughs) I actually said that to Fat Mike: „It doesn’t really matter, I can take anything I want, because you owe me big time! We’re gonna play it anyway!“ But things like that are what come in written. Everything else is totally made up by the band. That’s why I love this record: Because we were making everything up.

Musicscan: (Adrian) Do you have some influence on the lyrics?

Bad Religion: (Jay) Usually only veto power. If I think that something is inconsistent or there is something cryptic and could be construed negatively I tell Greg or Brett: „I know you don’t mean that, but if I see it that way other people will also see it that way.“ It doesn’t happen very often.

Musicscan: (Adrian) Recently we watched your ’89 „Suffer-Tour“ Video „Along The Way“. In one of the interviews you said that the music has to be simple and catchy to transport the lyrics.

Bad Religion: (Jay) What I said was that the music has to be good!

Musicscan: (Adrian)That’s true, alright.

Bad Religion: (Jay) The question was: „What’s more important: music or lyrics?“

Musicscan: (Adrian) Right.

Bad Religion: (Jay) Greg would always say that the lyrics are more important and I say: „If the music sucks, nobody is going to listen to it!“

Musicscan: (Adrian) So you wouldn’t say it has to be simple...

Bad Religion: (Jay) No, it just has to be good! It has to be something that you don’t mind listening to...

Musicscan: (Adrian) Ok. In an interview with an internet fanzine in the mid-nineties you stated: „Melodic Punk isn’t dangerous anymore!“ What do you think about this sentence today, because in America this New Metal trend which propagates patriotic and sometimes even christian messages is quite influential (P.O.D. or Kid Rock for example). Don’t you think that punk rock has to be an alternative to this bands?

Bad Religion: (Jay) Yeah, music is such a hybrid right now. What do you think Linkin Park is? What would you call Linkin Park?

Musicscan: (Jan) The media in Germany classify them as nu metal or maybe crossover. (Adrian) But I don’t know the guys behind the music, I don’t know what they are actually thinking.

Bad Religion: (Jay) I don’t either. I don’t think you can do that anymore. I don’t think you can have this separation anymore. You can either say „This sucks!“ or it doesn’t. And if it doesn’t suck, then I‘ll listen to it! Consider that 17 million people like Linkin Park and I don’t own the album. Maybe I’m the one that’s wrong?! But that’s okay...

Musicscan: (Adrian) Do you know this band „P.O.D.“? They are very big in Germany right know and they are playing concerts with american flags on the stage and they support christian dogmas. I don’t think it’s an alternative, but it’s actually mainstream!

Bad Religion: (Jay) So, how long do you think they will last?

Musicscan: (Adrian) Perhaps just one or two albums?!

Bad Religion: (Jay) Yeah, that’s very short-sighted. I’m not certainly sure where they suddenly come out, it’s just like: „Here we are!“ (Laughs)

Musicscan: (Adrian) In my opinion punk rock is a good alternative to these bands.

Bad Religion: (Jay) Oh, I don’t know about punk rock anymore, the concept of what punk rock was in the beginning was totally different from what it became in the mid-eighties which was totally different to what it is now! But the one thing that we’ve learned is: It’s a small world! There are more pressing global problems! It’s a lot better to basically try to be global. It doesn’t make any sense to become nationalistic as a rock band!

Musicscan: (Adrian) So you don’t label yourself as a punk, because it’s not important?

Bad Religion: (Jay) I’ll always be a punk! I’ll be punk until I die! That’s what I am.

Musicscan: (Adrian) But perhaps it’s not important if you regard this globally?

Bad Religion: (Jay) I always get the feeling that punks are global. I always think that, but that’s the people that I know! (Jays mobile rings, short intermission). But that’s just me. And that’s the people that I know. They just become aware of a world larger than their own. You can’t just live in one country, it doesn’t work like that anymore!

Musicscan: (Adrian) Actually, in America after september 11th there is a growing tendency to generally become more patriotic and nationalistic.

Bad Religion: (Jay) I think maybe so and it’s kinda scary. I’m an American and the people that I talk to say things like: „It pulled America together!“ and I stop them and tell them: „You know, it pulled the world together!“ It’s not about America against anybody, the whole world feels the same way! People are just as terryfied in Australia or Germany or Russia as the people in New York or Washington D.C. It’s a chilling, frightening thing that has happened but the Americans tend to not look past their borders! And that’s true. We’ve been saying that forever, we know that!

Musicscan: (Adrian) Don’t you think it would be necessary to become more radical in your lyrical expressions to stress that this problem is immanent?

Bad Religion: (Jay) I don’t think that we ever shied away from saying that America is not what it seems.

Musicscan: (Adrian) That’s true, especially on „The New America“.

Bad Religion: (Jay) You know, I don’t like people to tell me what to do and I don’t want to have people screaming in my face which is neither one of the things Bad Religion does. And when people say: „Hey, you should really write a song about this!“ I say „We will, but we will do it in a way that it is just a question!“.

Musicscan: (Adrian) So people have to think themselves.

Bad Religion: (Jay) I don’t like bands who assume they have the answers, because I certainly don’t!

Musicscan: (Adrian) You’re just giving the people some information, so they will focus on this issue.

Bad Religion: (Jay) Yes, to make up their own minds! I‘m not going to tell them what to do. Let them figure it out!

Musicscan: (Jan) Do you have an idea which punk or other bands are important in this regard? What bands do you listen to? Do you still go to concerts as a fan?

Bad Religion: (Jay) Yes...(long thinking pause)...lyrically important...I’ve always been a big fan of „The Clash“. I still listen to all their records. There are some bands - well, I understand what they are trying to do (laughs), but it always seems forced to me! It seems like they are trying to be something that they are not. And that always seems like bad Jackson Pollock (American abstract painter, 1912-1956) maybe, I just don’t get it. Right now, most of the music that I’m listening to is „Elvis Costello“ and „The Matthew Good Band“, a band from Vancouver. That’s about it.

Musicscan: (Jan) So there aren’t many punk rock albums way up in your shelf now?

Bad Religion: (Jay) No, I get all the punk rock albums and I listen to them once and then I’ll file them, because I listen to this everyday!

Musicscan: (Adrian) Sure.

Bad Religion: (Jay) „The Beatsteaks“, the band we played with last night, they were amazing! And I don’t have their new album, it just came out, so I don’t have it, but I want to get that! But usually I’ve seen and heard all of them (laughs)! And so I’m thinking „Fuck it, there’s not much out there!“

Musicscan: (Adrian) What they do is nothing new to you.

Bad Religion: (Jay) Unfortunately for someone I’m a brutally honest person. When it comes to music and I’m telling them their music sucks, they are shocked. Haha. But anyway, people can also say this to me. I mean, that’s just fair. (Jays mobile rings once again, a longer intermission follows.)

Musicscan: (Jan) We‘d like to talk about a rather delicate issue: The ticket prices. They are pretty high, about 25 €.

Bad Religion: (Jay) I thought it was only 19 €...

Musicscan: (Jan) There are probably some old fans from the underground who don’t want to spend that much. What do you think about this?

Bad Religion: (Jay) That’s right. I am a supporter of trying to make everything reasonable. There was a magazine which was selling a framed poster with a ticket on it. The price on the ticket said 6 $. It was a poster from Woodstock in 1968. We’ve got 2002 now, a CD costs 15 €. MacDonalds is five bucks for a happy meal. I’m charging ten bucks for a t-shirt tonight. But that’s just me. Other bands don’t do that. Ticket prices...(thinks for a while)...I’d like to see everyone be happy. But you know what? I know that noone will ever be happy.

Musicscan: (Adrian) We don’t want you to misunderstand us. We are not those guys who want you to play for 5 €. It’s just...

Bad Religion: (Jay) ...No, I understand, and I know these people will be mad. But I am not upset or something like that.

Musicscan: (Adrian) We just wanted to hear your opinion about that.

Bad Religion: (Jay) I think it’s 5 € too high. I think 20 is fair. 15 is cool, and 10 is fabulous. But I just know the reality of things... This is certainly not the answer for everyone who is upset about that! My personal opinion is that a Bad Religion show should cost as much as a CD. I think this one is too expensive. Maybe it costs as much like a Japanese Import CD?! (laughs) How about that? (Laughs even more)

Musicscan: (Jan) Let’s make a step back to the new album again. Will Mr. Brett go on tour with you?

Bad Religion: (Jay) He’s on the road with us now. When we do longer tours he has to go back to Epitaph, so he’ll do what he can. I don’t know what that means. Basically there will be a guitar amp on stage every night and maybe he’ll be there… We don’t know yet.

Musicscan: (Jan) How does it feel for you personally that Brett rejoined Bad Religion? There are some rumors which claim that he left the band in 1994 also because of some trouble between you and him...

Bad Religion: (Jay) The thing that happened between us was something that happens a million times in a band. That’s just the way bands are. People in bands fight, quit and tell each other to go fuck themselves all the time. But never in the history of Bad Religion was one member completely absorbed by another project. This project happened to be Epitaph as a label and that’s true. It just opened up a lot of doors for him. When we had our fight, which was was mundane and stupid and about nothing, and he quit, he didn’t quit because of me. It was the logical thing for him to do, saying “I don’t need to do this, fuck this, I’m out. I have to run Epitaph!“

Musicscan: (Adrian) But today it is not a problem anymore?

Bad Religion: (Jay) It was never a problem. It never was a problem for me and it was never a problem for him. I would see Brett a lot in L.A., like „Hey, dude!“ and that was it. So, when we started talking again was when we did the „New America“ album, which was supposed to be the 20th anniversary album, that’s what Greg and I were planning on, and I supposed: „We have to call Brett!“ If we’re going to do this anniversary thing, he has to be part of it.

Musicscan: (Adrian) So he wrote the song "Believe It"...

Bad Religion: (Jay) So he wrote this song. I called him later at the office: „Hey, great song! I’m sorry you didn’t come to the studio, because it was fun!“. He didn’t come out to record it with us. We just sent him the tapes and he did the lead over it, and I said: „Oh well, next time.“ And next time became this new album!

Musicscan: (Adrian) We’d furthermore like to talk about your cooperation with the German band „Die Toten Hosen“. What was the point in doing this? Was it for the German fans, because you are friends or was it a marketing thing?

Bad Religion: (Jay) The only reason to have Campino sing on anything we do is to sell millions of records, because he’s just ultimately handsome! (Laughs, short intermission) This story is funny. Greg was in New York and he was going to sing the lead vocals on that song and Campino was actually coming up from South America and stopping in New York for two days. We heard that he was coming up here and I talked to Bobby about that and he said: „He should sing on Punk Rock Song!“ and I said: „Yeah!“. It was just like that, it just happened.

Musicscan: (Adrian) It wasn’t planned long ago.

Bad Religion: (Jay) Every guest on our records we ever had just came in and it just happened. It just does.

Musicscan: (Jan) What is your relationship to „Die Toten Hosen“? Is there a friendship between the two bands?

Bad Religion: (Jay) I’ll tell you the funniest thing about all the guys like Andy, Kuddel and Breiti. We’ve been coming here since 1989 and since the very first time we came here, there have always been those fucking spiky-headed guys hanging out in our dressing room, drinking our beer and everybody knows them except me. I said: „Who the fuck are these guys?! They are always out on our shows, I don’t know the hell who they are, but everybody knows them and likes them!“ So I guessed I had to be nice to them even if I don’t know who the fuck they are. After the sixth year someone told me that they are in a band, and I replied: „Oh! I mean, yes, they look like a band! ‚Die Toten Hosen‘, my god, whatever!“ „But they have a lot of records out!“ „(Bored) Yeah, ok, that’s great...“ „Here’s their last record.“ „Ok, I’m gonna play that.“ And it was very good, a good band! Maybe we could play with them together, maybe they could be opening some shows for us or whatever. Though I still didn’t have the concept here at all. I was told that they’re going to play a show and I said: „Ok, I’m coming down, watching a punk rock show.“ (Laughs) I got there and there were a hundred thousand people (laughs) and I watched them play and I thought: „Oh, holy shit!!!“ (laughs) But because that was the way we got to know them and hang out with them there was never anything forced or weird. I never felt uncomfortable, it became an honest friendship. I really started to like them for them. I didn’t know who they were or what they did, which was totally cool.

Musicscan: (Adrian) Sure.

Bad Religion: (Jay) Even now when I know them, I don’t get weird and think: „Oh, Campino is coming over, how COOL!“

Musicscan: (Adrian) So, you met them as persons not as a band.

Bad Religion: (Jay) Yes and I like that: Meeting people and not knowing anything about them. When I meet people I don’t say that I’m the bass player in Bad Religion. I just hang out with them and later they tell me: „You should have mentioned you’re playing in a band!“ „Why? Would it change me? Would it make me different?“ Ok, that was just a little side story...(laughs)

Musicscan: (Adrian) I think we don’t have much time left...

Bad Religion: (Jay) Oh, that’s ok, I’m here until we’re done!

Musicscan: (Adrian) It’s just because you look very tired!

Bad Religion: (Jay) It’s ok. It’s tour-tired! I’m always tired.

Musicscan: (Jan) So, how many interviews did you give today?

Bad Religion: (Jay) (Thinks a while)...five..

Musicscan: (Jan) Does it stress you out?

Bad Religion: (Jay) No. There are some people who get stressed out by interviews, but I like them. People think that I’m a problem because I’m too honest. They ask me: „What do you think about this band?“ and I reply: „Oh, I don’t like them!“ „You don‘t like them???“ „No, I don’t particularly care for them!“ „Oh?! But...“ (Laughs)

Musicscan: (Jan) Ok, let’s talk about Bad Religion again. What’s the personal relationship between the members of the band? Is there still friendship or do you just work together? I mean, you live all across America, do you still see each other or do you have some regular contact by phone? Or is it just like you work on one album like a project during some months a year and then you have no contact at all?

Bad Religion: (Jay) Well, we work together obviously, when we are together. When we’re at home I probably call Brian twice a week, I call Brett and Greg...I actually call Brett more now because he’s not only my guitar player, he’s also the owner of the label I’m on, so I call him more to talk about those things. (Thinks for a while). It’s always been like that even when we lived around the corner from each other we didn’t really...We hung out together a lot in the beginning of the band because we were fifteen and we gotta stick together, we were homies. It’s your posse! (Laughs) I think when you get older, you have different friends as you do different things, but you’re still in a band together. That’s probably the reason why we’re still here! I mean, we don’t sleep in each others bed, fuck that! We don’t own one car! „(funny voice) Where‘s the car? Who’s got the car?“ (Laughs)

Musicscan: (Adrian) I read a story about the band „Napalm Death“ a few months ago. They are living together in one apartment!

Bad Religion: (Jay) Yeah, that’s unbelievable. You know, eight weeks spending in a tour bus with twelve guys, every day, is like living in a submarine! Ok, I’m gonna do anything I can to not kill everyone. I’m going to hang in here and it is all going to be good. And after that I couldn’t imagine seeing those guys again. Just go away and I’ll go away´and everybody goes away.

Musicscan: (Adrian) So after a few months you are motivated to be involved again.

Bad Religion: (Jay) Yes.

Musicscan: (Adrian) There’s a question left we are sure you don’t want to hear: Will there ever be an official rerelease of the second Bad Religion album „Into The Unknown“?

Bad Religion: (Jay) Yes, actually it is right now! Bro’Sis (Voices? Boy-Sys? Whatever...) is rerecording it and they are putting it out as a dance project!

Musicscan: (Jan/Adrian) ???

Bad Religion: (Jay) (Laughs) No. Never. It wasn’t good and that was the problem!

Musicscan: (Adrian) It was interesting...

Bad Religion: (Jay) If you want to use that words...haha! We were a band with our own label and our own money and we were producing it. It was a logical mistake.We went to the studio and Greg had a keyboard! So put this two things together: Oh my god, what shit! That’s pretty much what it was. There was nobody there who stepped in and said: „What the hell you guys are doing?!“ and I said: „What the hell you guys are doing?!“ They said: „(Funny voice) This is COOL!“ and I replied: „No way, I’m out!!!“

Musicscan: (Jan) You mean it was a waste of money, time and resource...

Bad Religion: (Jay) It was a waste of the plastic it was pressed on! It’s so bad that...that...whatever! (Laughs)

Musicscan: (Adrian) I’d like to confront you with one last quote from the „Along The Way“ tour video. Greg said: „I don’t want to get to the point when I’m losing more hair and I get fat so that I‘m an embarrassement on stage.“

Bad Religion: (Jay) Yeah, „I want someone to tell me when I’m too fat, too bald and too bored.“ (Laughs) I’m right with you on that quote! I don’t know...

Musicscan: (Adrian) I don’t think it’s embarrassing, but...

Bad Religion: (Jay) There were about three people who came up so far and told us: „It’s time! Remember the video? Now!“ I understand the sentiment Greg was getting at, because I think that I’ve seen people who are physically...I don’t really care what people look like, I don‘ t give a shit if you blow up to 500 pounds and lose all the single hair of your head! That is not the issue to me, what bothers me more than that is becoming complacent, being lazy.

Musicscan: (Adrian) Perhaps like the Sex Pistols on their reunion tour?

Bad Religion: (Jay) Yes. There’s no passion, it’s basically Sex Pistols Karaoke.

Musicscan: (Adrian) It’s like some old men cover Sex Pistols songs.

Bad Religion: (Jay) Right. And that’s way more irritating to me than anything else. In that video there there were a couple of things, like Greg Hetson said “I don’t do anything, I just play Nintendo”, and people still say “What are you doing? Do you still play Nintendo?” But this was like 14 years ago. I think it was because Brett and I were working at Epitaph and people were calling and we did a lot of interviews. We learned very quickly: when you say stupid things like that, they come back to haunt you for the rest of your life! You try to avoid that. Me, personally, I don’t really care. People come back to me and claim: „You one time said this!“ I give a shit what I said, I’ll say anything once. „It doesn’t matter, it was a matter to me yesterday.“ „But it was yesterday!“ I don’t care if it was yesterday, it is a whole new day! But that’s something you just have to deal with ...(laughs)

Musicscan: (Adrian) There’s one issue which is personally interesting to me, it’s the Bad Religion research fund. Are there any plans to grant this fund to people who aren’t from the USA?

Bad Religion: (Jay) Sure, it’s never been about where you’re from.

Musicscan: (Adrian) I thought it was restricted to people from the USA?

Bad Religion: (Jay) I don’t believe that to be true!

Musicscan: (Adrian) But I read it on www.badreligion.com ?!

Bad Religion: (Jay) Then I’ll take it off!

Musicscan: (Adrian) I’m not sure if it is actually the case now, but it was a few months ago.

Bad Religion: (Jay) I don’t even know why it should be there. It’s silly!

Musicscan: (Adrian) I thought it was to limit the incoming papers.

Bad Religion: (Jay) No, the only thing that we have said is that we won’t fund any laboratory experiments. Because there’s enough money. And it’s not the thing that we have tons of money! I mean, most of the research grants we do are about 2.000 $. That’s all we have. People write in and they’re telling us what their project is and what they are studying and what they need to finish. It is not about how much money do you need to get started or how much money do you want to hang out and drink more beer, it’s about how much money you need to finish your project.

Musicscan: (Jan) How many applications do you get?

Bad Religion: (Jay) I think last time we got 1200.

Musicscan: (Jan) This is a lot!

Bad Religion: (Jay) It’s a lot! It’s pretty easy to filter through thousand where you just think „What the hell is this?“ Literally like written with crayon, saying: „We need more money for beer!“, so we just laugh and throw it away! Once you get down to the serious 70 or 75 papers it takes a lot of time, maybe three or four months of work, reading them until you can select ten, then reading those ten again and then you take the best one. And that’s hard! Even though it’s not a lot of money you put in someone’s project you’re sorry about the other’s. We’re trying to get other people to put money into the fund as well so we don’t have to support just one project, but maybe five or ten! It really is not a ton of money for a person, it would be feasible if you could get 10.000 $ a year in this fund.

Musicscan: (Adrian) Yes, but for the individual it is sufficient money to finish his project.

Bad Religion: (Jay) Or for ten individuals!

Musicscan: (Adrian) Would be even better...

Bad Religion: (Jay) Sure.

Musicscan: (Adrian) I think that’s about it...

Bad Religion: (Jay) That’s it?!

Musicscan: (Adrian/Jan) Yes, thank you very much for the interview and for reserving so much time for us!

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